His Majesty's Dragons

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:32 pm

I! LIVE! AGAIN!

Sort of.

My computer setup seems to be mis-interfacing with LA, and I've been spending most of the afternoon trying to find a workaround. B4 finally provided me with one, in the form of using another server to bounce my connection off of (essentially), so I am able to post again. Unfortunately I am not able to post this instant, so I shall merely comment in OOC.

Frostfell is welcome to mess with Capricorn. I assume, if he does, that Cyncat has another character he's prepared to propose as a replacement? Acid-spitters and fire-breathers are combination ground-air killers. Venomspitters and other poisonous dragons are not all that useful at ground attack, but are concentrated death to dragons. Their venoms can kill on skin or scale contact :)

...

... do we HAVE to discuss draconic masturbation and homosexuality though? In the THIRD PAGE?! Good lord people...

... also I had missed that section there when I originally read it. I have to go scour my eyes with bleach now. :(

LadyTevar · Post by **LadyTevar** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:50 pm

General Havoc wrote:... do we HAVE to discuss draconic masturbation and homosexuality though? In the THIRD PAGE?! Good lord people...

... also I had missed that section there when I originally read it. I have to go scour my eyes with bleach now. :(

With this group? Get used to it. Just wait, you already have two guys flirting with the only female captain.

As for the section, I had to read it twice just to make sure it was really saying what I thought it was saying. Amusingly enough, it was.

Comrade Tortoise · Post by **Comrade Tortoise** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:44 pm

... do we HAVE to discuss draconic masturbation and homosexuality though? In the THIRD PAGE?! Good lord people...

Rule 34

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:57 pm

I'm glad you're back Havoc. Hope you have time to address my PM soon.

LadyTevar · Post by **LadyTevar** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 12:03 am

Thanks to Frigid for digging this up:
WWII Flight Gear. This is both authentic and recreation gear shown on this page, but damn if it don't look warm! I know that dragons wouldn't be flying as high as a WWII Bomber, but the heated suits would be very nice a-dragonback. Just have to figure out what they'd plug into... maybe the Dragon Harness itself, since the crew and Captain do have to strap themselves down?

In the novels, this is done by carbiners and straps... I guess a good comparison would be rock-climbing gear, since the 1804 crews often move from atop to underneath the dragon like sailors on a ship, fastening and refastening carbiners as they move along the dragon. Quick maneuvers by the dragon can and will knock them off their feet and leave them dangling by the straps.

Since even the small dragons would have a good-sized harness and a belly-net to carry needed supplies, a battery stored in the belly-net hooked to the harness could power radio and other gear used by the Captain and Crew.

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 5:20 am

All right, a few notes.

I'm sorry, I would have mentioned this if I could see the thread for the past couple of days, but there's no way that Frostfell or anyone else for that matter in this squadron has yet seen, let alone fought or killed a Stuka. They were not deployed in the Battle of France, and they do not do line-work. Stukas are the secret elite of the elite of Nazi Germany. When you see them, you will know something very unfortunate is about to happen. At this stage in the war, almost none have ever been encountered in combat, and most of those who encountered them didn't survive to tell the tale. They are almost wholly unknown to everyone. Nobody has yet killed one and lived to tell about it.

Flight gear for aviators varies by country, but warm suits are common, though oxygen masks are not necessary as you are not flying that high. Many dragons do carry batteries slung to their harnesses somewhere both to operate the radios, and the turrets with the machine guns in them. They do not however have anything beyond that yet. Radar does not yet exist in a form that can be placed on a dragon, and at any rate I should not have to tell you what problems might exist with strapping a generator to your dragons. One incindiary bullet in the fuel tank....

... not that getting one's battery shot is a lot of fun.

All flight crew carry parachutes (the Japanese being a pathological exception here), as well as the carabiners that everyone uses to strap themselves to the dragon. Feel free to improvise any more modern rock climbing gear as long as it remains period. Most flight suits are not heated, because dragons do not have engines, and one is not commonly plugged into a seat somewhere. Heavy woolen or fur parkas and the like are more common, as well as the flak jackets that aviators wear.

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:38 am

As per the request of Frigid Magi (And I do beg his pardon for my unconscionable delay), here is another prime breed from the American Heartland:

Nebraskan Amberback: The heavyweight of choice of the United States Air Force, the Nebraskan Amberback is so-named for its scales of soft amber, a color described as that of a field of wheat in the sunset, that covers its back and wings and fades to a light maple cream color on its underside. Named for the location where it was first bred, specifically Offut Air Force Base, near Bellvue, Nebraska, the Amberback is at home at air bases all across the great plains, and can be found from Montana to Ohio, as well as on assignments anywhere in the world. Larger than the Minuteman of New England, and of comparable size to all but the most monstrously enormous heavyweights, Amberbacks have seen service in every American war since their creation, and have proven themselves to be effective, powerful, and cunning fighters, more than capable of holding their own against their European counterparts.

Many Heavyweights, conscious of their size, power, and indispensability, form arrogant (if accurate) opinions of themselves, demanding privileges and rights due to beasts of their magnificence and might. Amberbacks do not. Like the Regal Coppers that they are descended from, Nebraskan Amberbacks are placid, calm beasts, who delight in the simpler things in life, and have an almost child-like enthusiasm for the new and exciting sights to be seen beyond the farms and prairies that they inevitably grow up in. They tend to be courteous, plain-spoken, honest beasts, referred to by grudgingly admiring heartlanders as "good, red-blooded, corn-fed, American dragons" (despite the fact that like almost all dragons, their blood is actually black, and their diet entirely carnivorous). Indeed, they are stereotypically "American" to a degree that Normal Rockwell would find intolerable, a quality that defies precise description, but makes them both eminently pleasant beasts, and also eminently boring to many. Some appreciate the tradeoff more than others.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:33 pm

YEEE-HAW! Y'all are gonna catch it now.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:47 pm

frigidmagi wrote:YEEE-HAW! Y'all are gonna catch it now.

It's a Y'ALL! Run, we going to be buried under Southern US accents! The End is nigh!

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 5:54 pm

Damnit, they're not all southerners! I will not have TWO players in this game typing their posts in english dialect!!!

MY EYES!!!!

LadyTevar · Post by **LadyTevar** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:03 pm

General Havoc wrote:Damnit, they're not all southerners! I will not have TWO players in this game typing their posts in english dialect!!!

MY EYES!!!!

Now, hon, don'cha worry, Ah'm sure he ain't near as bad as me.

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:25 pm

I want to stress that in this game the airplane is nowhere near as advanced or as common as it was in our reality, for the simple reason that there was not considered a need for it. I can go into that fact in detail if necessary, and yes, I appreciate that the automobile was invented even though horses existed, but my position is that it would have been invented even faster had horses not existed (I won't go into the other implications that would have had). Zepplins and the like were tried in WWI but rejected as useless against dragon attack (imagine a Spitfire going after the Hindenburg). Some small airplanes were developed and saw design and even use as mail carriers and the like, they were not considered practical weapons of war, and still are not. Rocketry is still in development, airplanes barely at 1910-levels of development and in use by no air force I am aware of. All this may change in time.

Dirigibles (Blimps) on the other hand, have a role, though mostly a conventional one. Military Zepplins (as I said before) suffer from disadvantages while fighting dragons that should be obvious. There are however... certain rumors running about regarding some descendant of the Dirigible... something called a "Floating Fortress".

But then you all should know better than to trust rumors

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:35 pm

Civilian aircraft would certainly exist and it wouldn't take a genius to predict the eventual emergence of military ones in 1940. Fighters flying at hundreds of miles an hour and packing multiple 20mm cannons don't exist yet, in universe, but their eventual existence isn't hard to predict.

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 8:59 pm

Honestly, with Dirigibles still considered a valid bit of consumer technology, I don't see even civilian airplanes as we understand them save for perhaps the pre-WWI mail couriers and such. It takes a LOT to kill a dragon, as I've said. It would require jet-powered aircraft with heavy machine cannon or air to air missiles to really convincingly bring a middle or heavy one down.

You all don't need to worry about obscelecence just yet. Most of the aeronautical research done has been channelled towards how to better employ, equip, and breed dragons, not replace them. There's psychological and political reasons for this as well, the Dreadnought effect.

Either way, there are no airplanes to speak of for any of you to worry about.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 9:25 pm

A turbo prop with two 20mm, like a Messershmidt 109, should kill dragons quite nicely. Multiple 20mm and 30mm cannons weren't uncommon weapons on fighters of the era and rockets were widely used by the end of the war. Simple understandings of aerodynamics and advances in engine construction, necessary for tanks and all the other fun toys of war, are going to make airplanes the wave of the future. They may not exist now in game, but they will at sometime in the forseable future.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:01 am

Captain's Name: Paul
Captain's Age: 25
Captain's Description: Part Irish/Scot, part Cherokee. He has black hair, brown eyes and skin that always seems lightly sunburned. Built like a brick. He is in many ways a the archetype of a Marine Combat Sgt, brave, blunt, foul mouthed, not especially fond of the rules and polite to women and children. On the flip side his father was preacher and his mother a school teacher, he's better read and educated then your standard marine and due to being brought up in Cherokee controlled Oklahoma territory he speaks Cherokee and English along with a bit of Spanish (mostly swear words).

Dragon's Name: Lydia (If you do not get the joke check Acts Chapter 16 verse 14)
Dragon's Age: 2 years old
Dragon's Breed: Nebraskan Amberback
Dragon's Description : Huge, powerful and golden. Your standard Amberback is polite, honest and upright. Lydia, however was raised by a marine. She is honest, polite and upright... In a way. She has been called the bluntest, most foul mouthed dragon to ever say please and thank you. Needless to say the rest of her breed considers her a manic.

Background: Paul was born in Central Oklahoma in the year 1915 to a Irish/Scott pastor and a Cherokee schoolteacher, he joined the marines fresh out of his one room highschool in 1933 and reenlisted in 1937. He saw duty in the standard areas of Marine deployment and action, Central America, the Republic of California and most recently in North Mexico(New Mexico) in a campaign against a Mexican â€œRevolutionaryâ€

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:28 am

Cynical Cat wrote:A turbo prop with two 20mm, like a Messershmidt 109, should kill dragons quite nicely. Multiple 20mm and 30mm cannons weren't uncommon weapons on fighters of the era and rockets were widely used by the end of the war. Simple understandings of aerodynamics and advances in engine construction, necessary for tanks and all the other fun toys of war, are going to make airplanes the wave of the future. They may not exist now in game, but they will at sometime in the forseable future.

Even with a 20mm-armed fighter, one needs a lot of fire to convincingly kill a middle or heavyweight. Dragons are a lot bigger than a fighter, and heavyweights larger even than the largest bomber in the war, and are both armored with scales and with actual chain or plate armor. This is not to say that the fighter couldn't kill the dragon, but the dragon's liable to have weaponry aboard as well, quad-mount 20mms are not unheard of for the heavyweights, and the fighter can take a lot less fire than the dragon can.

So yes, in the foreseeable future it is possible that dragons will find themselves obsolete, but nobody is thinking of that for this war just yet.

As to Paul and Lydia (I tell people that Latin names are traditional, and what do they all go and do?...) it looks fine to me, although Heavyweight dragons are not so common that most countries will simply send one off to a foreign war because their captain broke some bastard's nose. I suppose the US' policy is to tacitly support Britain though...

Works in any case. You all could use another heavyweight given what I'm about to throw at you...

LadyTevar · Post by **LadyTevar** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:37 am

Lydia is Latin!

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:39 am

A .50 cal will shoot through a brick wall to kill a guy on the other side. No armor a dragon will be carrying will stop a 20mm and even with unrealistic toughness, they'll hurt. A Me-262, by the way, carried 2 20mm and 2 30mm cannon.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:46 am

Lydia is actually a Greek name. Straight from the time of the New Testament before the fall of Rome. And if you expect a Marine Sgt who has only a high school education to know any latin names beyond the handfull used by popular culture of the time... You're dreaming.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:52 am

Also: Cat I mean no offense but this level of back talk is jarring and unbelievable for me. One simply does not talk down to his leading officer, I don't give a shit if he is a dragonic incarnation of Shiva and other such gods of war and death.

Seriously if a Marine acted that way he would be beaten into mush.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:26 pm

frigidmagi wrote:Also: Cat I mean no offense but this level of back talk is jarring and unbelievable for me. One simply does not talk down to his leading officer, I don't give a shit if he is a dragonic incarnation of Shiva and other such gods of war and death.

Seriously if a Marine acted that way he would be beaten into mush.

I'll take that under consideration. I'm trying to balance the notorious Wendigo assholishness into it and I might be leaning a bit too hard in that direction.

LadyTevar · Post by **LadyTevar** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:27 pm

Cynical Cat wrote:
frigidmagi wrote:Also: Cat I mean no offense but this level of back talk is jarring and unbelievable for me. One simply does not talk down to his leading officer, I don't give a shit if he is a dragonic incarnation of Shiva and other such gods of war and death.

Seriously if a Marine acted that way he would be beaten into mush.
I'll take that under consideration. I'm trying to balance the notorious Wendigo assholishness into it and I might be leaning a bit too hard in that direction.

Might?

General Havoc · Post by **General Havoc** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:56 pm

Hehe, it's your call as to how to balance it Cynical. You're certainly way past the bounds of normal draconic discipline, but Wendigo are not normal dragons. I'm not in any position to tell you how to play your character, as long as you're prepared for the consequences if Frostfell REALLY goes too far.

And you're very right about both the .50 cal and the 20mm. The armor is mostly there for shrapnel and to slow incoming rounds a bit (and of course for the enemy dragons). It still takes a good bit of 20mm fire to bring down a dragon, especially a big one. Besides, the Me-262 was a jet fighter, many generations removed from the best that's on offer right now. If this game were set in the Cold War, you'd no doubt have to worry about aircraft, but as it stands, you should be fine.

And there's no problem with the non-latin names. I was just commenting...

Also... I seem to have screwed up. I had Ã†quitas use the term 'colonial', forgetting that I hadn't explained what he meant by it. 'Colonial', in the sense that Dragons use it, means feral, not "from the colonies". It's a disparaging term for undomesticated, undisciplined dragons, that a lot of the more intelligent (and arrogant) breeds use at times to refer to breeds like the Wendigo, the Parnassian, the Widowmakers, and other more... aggressively assertive breeds. I am ashamed to admit that it completely passed my mind that Ã†quitas was actually talking about dragons from the dominion and America, and that it would naturally be interpreted that way. My own fault and nobody else's. The term actually has nothing to do with what the humans would call colonies, Australia and Canada and whatnot, but "breeding colonies" which is where feral and unharnessable dragons are sent to be of SOME use to the countries that upkeep them. Dragons from such places have a reputation for being unruly, undisciplined, and impossible to manage.

So er... I'll leave it up to all of you how to interpret his comment. Your dragons would be aware of the meaning of the word, but you can take it however you like. I screwed it up by not explaining and by using the term to begin with, and I'll deal with the consequences. Can't ask a player to do what the GM won't. I'm sure he'll be mortified to learn what Kunja thought he meant.

Cynical Cat · Post by **Cynical Cat** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:00 pm

The arnament of an Me262 wasn't exceptional for the late war and I never implied that combat aircraft would be ready to fight this war, just the next one.

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His Majesty's Dragons

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