STGOD! OOC Thread.

[Comrade Tortoise]

Question:

Is it reasonable that some or all of those guns would be in position and at least some of them manned on watch rotations? Again, even with stand down orders it would be stupid to not do so with an army massed at the border.

That would not apply to the base in Leipzig, but it would apply to the alps

[Cynical Cat]

It's not impossible they would get spotted. Its hard though and then they have to correctly interpret what they've spotted as a sneak attack from a supposed ally. That interpretation has to be made and then passed around and up the chain of command and all of that takes time and there isn't much of it. Japanese planes coming into attack Pearl Harbor were misidentified as American as much too late and they had much more reason to be suspicious and better detection tools.

Planes going to attack Switzerland aren't going to cross the border at Vienna. Vienna's too far north.

[Comrade Tortoise]

It's not impossible they would get spotted. Its hard though and then they have to correctly interpret what they've spotted as a sneak attack from a supposed ally. That interpretation has to be made and then passed around and up the chain of command and all of that takes time and there isn't much of it. Japanese planes coming into attack Pearl Harbor were misidentified as American as much too late and they had much more reason to be suspicious and better detection tools.

Planes going to attack Switzerland aren't going to cross the border at Vienna. Vienna's too far north.

Where will they cross then? I used Vienna as a benchmark only.

Look, i am tired of bickering about it. Would you like to negotiate a position at which they are detected, identified etc?

It would help to clarify whether your launches or arrivals are simultaneous.

For hell's sake man, I am already going to lose the battle and war, you might as well let me shoot down a few planes. It will make me feel better.

[Cynical Cat]

Question:

Is it reasonable that some or all of those guns would be in position and at least some of them manned on watch rotations? Again, even with stand down orders it would be stupid to not do so with an army massed at the border.

That would not apply to the base in Leipzig, but it would apply to the alps

Oh, you'll have men on watch, that's not an issue. That's standard. Having them spot a night attack without radar and from a supposed ally and understanding that's what it was when planes have already been moving around between the countries is part of the issue. The other, is of course, what you can do with very little or no warning against massive force.

Frankly, I'm content to leave it up to frigid to issue the results. I'll undoubtedly see things a little differently than he does, but he'll be fair.

That I'm going to lose planes is also to be expected. The sneak attack gives me an advantage with penetrating your defences and catching you off guard, but its not a miracle that makes me immune to losses.

[Comrade Tortoise]

OK. SO things that need resolving before I can edit the post appropriately to meet reasonable versions of my strategic goals.

1) air Assault Warning Time, given that his strikes are supposed to be simultaneous (he told me), and that they must traverse an hour-1.5 hours worth of german territory to do it. Planes will be audible at ~loud whisper to casual speech, though at night and 20000 feet up. No idea how long it would take for "we are being attacked by the hungarians" to be decided and spread around to everyone else.

2) Given Warning time, what proportion of anti-air guns can I get to fire on his planes (I will calculate that by clusters of guns in points along the alps that make sense for them to be I suppose), and how many planes in each area can get scrambled.

3) Given that I will be editing the post only to cut off major routes through the alps as much as possible, what can I actually do? Railroads are easy, but I only really need to disable one strategically important bridge or tunnel to slow down an alpine advance through any road capable of transporting his soldiers... and there are probably very few of those.

The goal is to slow him down and reduce the impact of his superior numbers by forcing his advance through controlled chokepoints and give me the ability (because we know the terrain, and he does not) to ambush and cut off supply lines. How much of that could I reasonably expect to get done before he breaks through the border defense?

If I am missing anything major, let me know.

[Hotfoot]

Ben, the values I gave were rough high end estimates for the sound, assuming the engines are about 120 decibels at 5 feet. Unbaffled jet engines are 140 decibels, for reference. Any quieter and you're really below a quiet whisper for sound. The amount of German territory also depends heavily on the flight path, but that's up to CynCat I suppose.

[Comrade Tortoise]

Ben, the values I gave were rough high end estimates for the sound, assuming the engines are about 120 decibels at 5 feet. Unbaffled jet engines are 140 decibels, for reference. Any quieter and you're really below a quiet whisper for sound. The amount of German territory also depends heavily on the flight path, but that's up to CynCat I suppose.

Was that calculated at sea level for those doing the listening?

[General Havoc]

Ben,

I know that reading my IC attack post is unlikely to be the most revealing thing in the world in terms of exact locations of attacks and all (I was writing narrative, not concise planning), but if you'll scroll back a page or two here in the OOC, you'll see I posted an edited version of my actual battle plan. It should help you get a sense of where the hell I'm going and what I'm doing there. My assault in the north was spread across your Alpine border with me, from Switzerland in the west to the Tyrol in the east. You indicated that you had one elite division with siege artillery re-enforcement guarding your border with me, and I presumed (being as there was no further information on them) that they were thus located all along my border.

[Comrade Tortoise]

Ben,

I know that reading my IC attack post is unlikely to be the most revealing thing in the world in terms of exact locations of attacks and all (I was writing narrative, not concise planning), but if you'll scroll back a page or two here in the OOC, you'll see I posted an edited version of my actual battle plan. It should help you get a sense of where the hell I'm going and what I'm doing there. My assault in the north was spread across your Alpine border with me, from Switzerland in the west to the Tyrol in the east. You indicated that you had one elite division with siege artillery re-enforcement guarding your border with me, and I presumed (being as there was no further information on them) that they were thus located all along my border.

Ah I see what you mean. Your original attack plan specified Die Sweiss in particular IIRC. I will give it a good look over

[Steve]

I've decided to just go ahead and do what I planned to do before being informed I had a "situation", which turned out to be the "war for the lulz" coming from AcNut.

I'm out of the game. Everybody have fun.

Oh, AcNut? If that bombardment you last posted about stands up and you burn Darwin and the harbor out? Congratulations, you just forfeited by burning the only harbor and port that can sustain a Mughal invasion of the Top End. With Darwin ruined as a port you have no way of sustaining a land force in the region.

Guess the Mughal Emperor will have to find another way to get an Australian opal in his crown, well, until the Grand Fleet gets there and you have to deal with a battle line with the AA and CVL-provided defensive air cover to swat your remaining carrier aircraft out of the sky and give your ships the choice of running or getting your carriers blasted by 16" and 17" gunfire.

[frigidmagi]

Event rolls:

Hotfoot



Windswept



Silence



Cleric



CT



Havoc



Cat



Slacker



Hadri



frigidmagi



Klavo



AcNut



Charon



Marcoa



Lonestar

[frigidmagi]

Windswept



Cat



Havoc

[frigidmagi]

Sunhawk

[frigidmagi]

Sunhawk

[Sunhawk]

Madagascar has a new unit! It's the single most badass unit in the game, so you all might as well surrender now. It'll hurt less that way.

http://www.badassoftheweek.com/voytek.html

[Hadrianvs]

Why is there now a Turkmenistan OOB? I rule Turkmenistan. The only countries missing an OOB are Tibet and Peru, and the only reason Peru hasn't been posted is because Magi asked me to check with Lonestar re: my the history of the country, and Lonestar never got back to me.

[Cynical Cat]

Why is there now a Turkmenistan OOB? I rule Turkmenistan. The only countries missing an OOB are Tibet and Peru, and the only reason Peru hasn't been posted is because Magi asked me to check with Lonestar re: my the history of the country, and Lonestar never got back to me.

It's actually part of China. In the real world it called itself the Republic of East Turkmenistan during the 30s and that's how Frigid referred to it. It's actually the pink part of the China map.

[Charon]

Why is there now a Turkmenistan OOB? I rule Turkmenistan. The only countries missing an OOB are Tibet and Peru, and the only reason Peru hasn't been posted is because Magi asked me to check with Lonestar re: my the history of the country, and Lonestar never got back to me.

I am 90% certain that Tibet is not meant to get an OOB, and is much like the Sudan as in that it does not have any central control. As for Turkmenistan, as Cat pointed out it is the pink country. As for it's name, it's not the first time two places have claimed the same name.

[Hadrianvs]

It's actually part of China. In the real world it called itself the Republic of East Turkmenistan during the 30s and that's how Frigid referred to it. It's actually the pink part of the China map.

East Turkestan, not East Turkmenistan.

[Cynical Cat]

It's actually part of China. In the real world it called itself the Republic of East Turkmenistan during the 30s and that's how Frigid referred to it. It's actually the pink part of the China map.

East Turkestan, not East Turkmenistan.

Whatever. I'll correct it.

[rhoenix]

So much for the ninja approach.

[Hotfoot]

I had wonderful plans to have gloriously drawn battle plans on google maps, complete with painstakingly laid out defenses to smash against, pretty lines, and all that.

However, as I am now hitting an NPC nation, I am going to simply adjust my deployments.

Red is the active forces pointed at Pacifica, blue are my forces giving a steely gaze to the strike force in Edmonton.

A pity this comes after Steve leaves the game, but oh well, it just means I'm a little less fancy about it. It certainly was interesting getting all the intel for this before it went the wrong way.

[Slacker]

I've gotta say, this game is really heading far too quickly in the direction of Risk or Diplomacy. We've got not one, not two, but three wars started or starting because people went 'durhur, declare war!'. As much as there's at least some history there to justify it in the case of Europe, the Mughal/Mexican/American gangbang of Pacifica is completely unjustified. Yes, I know the US and Mexico are manufacturing a casus bellum...but that shouldn't *be* in the first place. I can't see this game lasting more than a year if it's going to devolve to 'haha! *shank*' at every opporunity. Fuck, people are surprised I haven't jumped on the Germans yet, seemingly failing to realize I don't really have a way to justify it short of 'I want North Germany! Haha!'.

I heard good things about this place and they're not being justified right now, I have to say.

[frigidmagi]

Slacker, if folks want to declare war they're well within their rights. Now I understand your feelings, God knows Hotfoot and I argued about it (I tend to feel that a war out of the blue with Pacifica allied with a nation occupying US states makes no sense) but it's his country and he's free to do as he pleases. Frankly it's up to y'all to enforce better behavior with IN GAME ACTIONS. The reasons states don't do that now (although there have been times in history where they've done similar actions before) is other states make it bad business to do so.

Y'all haven't made it bad business and it's not the mods job to enforce that. I'm sorry if you're feeling it's a lousy game.

[Charon]

I second what Magi said. It is not the job of the mods to stop people from starting wars for no reason. You want to stop that you're going to have to take political action, just like people did in real life.

I'd also add that these wars are likely to be oddities. Quite simply, Havoc and Steve started with a lot of prime real estate, it is very expected that people are going to want that real estate. If you don't want people to act on that you need to make allies.