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#1 Harry Potter should be banned from schools?
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 12:30 am
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
Oh gimme' a break. 
Potter's Objectionable, Occultic Content Spurs Georgia Mom to Action
By Jim Brown
June 20, 2006
(AgapePress) - A Christian mom in Georgia is calling on the state board of education to remove Harry Potter books from her children's schools. It doesn't make sense, she says, to take the Bible out of schools, but allow the occult in.
The popular series of books by J.K. Rowling have sold more than 100 million copies worldwide and spawned four movies, with a fifth scheduled for release next year and a sixth in pre-production. But Laura Mallory of Loganville is looking past the worldwide attraction of the books, focusing on the local scene instead. The former missionary is appealing last month's decision by the Gwinnett County School Board to keep the popular children's books on school library shelves. Mallory says among other things, the books promote "evil themes, witchcraft, and demonic activity."
The occult-based storyline of the series has been a lightning rod of controversy among parents and educators since the books first hit the market. Mallory explains why she has strong reservations about Rowling's best-selling books -- and why she feels the books are not appropriate for youngsters.
"Some of the content includes evil characters: death-eaters, dementors, just demon-like creatures," she shares. "The violence and murder in the books -- there's even a five-year-old who's gruesomely murdered -- and the books expose and introduce occult practices to young readers, opening a door to their minds and hearts to this kind of stuff, the casting of spells."
Simply stated, Mallory asserts that "if they're going to take the Bible and prayer out of schools and let the occult in with total liberty, that is wrong -- and it's a violation of our rights."
A panel of community members, parents, and teachers at her children's elementary school voted down a complaint Mallory filed last year. After a public hearing, the county school board upheld the panel's decision. That is why she is petitioning the Georgia Board of Education.
"I'm hoping to find somebody who will really listen," Mallory explains. "The occult is dangerous to our children, and we need to get it out of our schools in all its forms."
Gwinnett School Board members argue that removing the Harry Potter books amounts to improper censorship of a harmless children's fantasy series.
#2
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 5:04 am
by Narsil
"Some of the content includes evil characters: death-eaters, dementors, just demon-like creatures," she shares.
The Bible, on the other hand, has beastiality, the devil himself, constant murder of men, women and children. A sadistic God who likes torturing his followers, and ordering men to sacrifice their own children only to say 'gotcha' at the last minute.
"The violence and murder in the books --
What, let's look at the Harry Potter death count, shall we.
Lilly Potter, book one
James Potter, book one
Quirrel, book one
Moaning Myrtle was killed fifty years prior to book two, and is still seen floating around as a ghost.
No one dies in book three
Cedric Diggory (IIRC) meets the recieving end of a killing curse in book four
Sirius Black is murdered in book five.
Albus Dumbledore is murdered in book six.
Thirteen people are mentioned to have died, and that was 'offscreen', so to speak.
That's, oh, twenty one people.
As opposed to the bible. Which had incidents of three thousand people murdered, every first born son in Egypt murdered, Jesus dying brutally only to be resurrected again.
there's even a five-year-old who's gruesomely murdered --
She'd have a point here, only that she doesn't, because there was no five year old murdered in Harry Potter. In fact, there was no five year old directly depicted in Harry Potter. Therefore: complete bullshit.
and the books expose and introduce occult practices to young readers, opening a door to their minds and hearts to this kind of stuff, the casting of spells."
The casting of spells which requires a wand. A wand which requires either a unicorn tail hair (doesn't exist), a phoenix tailfeather (doesn't exist), or the heartstring of a dragon (which again - does not exist).
In short; Another Ignorant Fundie Fucktard.
#3
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 5:35 am
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
I know, it's goddamn ridiculous. Harry Potter is not a religious book by any imaginable means. For starter, it doesn't tell the readers to follow certain religious standards.
I simply cannot understand why people cannot see Harry Potter as a fictional book for
entertainment purpose. I mean, does she
really believe saying 'Expecto Patronum' will actually summon a magical protector or such?
Just a thought: if a book as tame as Harry Potter is treated in such way, I wonder how fundies would react if their kids start reading HP Lovecraft? Iaa!!! Cthulhu fhtagn!!
#4
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 6:15 am
by Mayabird
I grew up surrounded by those types of people. One of my friends in high school tried to teach me how to play Magic: The Gathering and every time we played, we'd get harassed by people telling us that we were doing devil magic. And people wonder why I'm cynical and bitter.
Remember that we are not talking about smart or educated people here. They never let rationality or facts get in the way of whatever dumbshit idea got in their heads.
So it's Cthulhu time!
#5
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 6:42 am
by Batman
Oh noes. Evil characters in fiction? Valen forbid that a made-up story that's meant to entertain actually has bad guys!
That is one of the stupidest excuses for a point I've seen made so far.
As for the body count-Noah. Flood. How many people survived that again?
#6
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:48 am
by Something Awesome
I would have no objections to the Harry Potter books being banned, gathered together, and burned, but that's just because I find them to be truly awful stories. Harry Potter has as much literary merit to be in schools as, say, James Frey's A Million Little Pieces, or even the Pokemon movie novelizations.
They're not "bad" in the sense of "evil," but rather "bad" as in a "disgusting waste of trees."
#7
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:50 am
by B4UTRUST
Something Awesome wrote:I would have no objections to the Harry Potter books being banned, gathered together, and burned, but that's just because I find them to be truly awful stories. Harry Potter has as much literary merit to be in schools as, say, James Frey's A Million Little Pieces, or even the Pokemon movie novelizations.
They're not "bad" in the sense of "evil," but rather "bad" as in a "disgusting waste of trees."
Truth...
#8
Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 12:25 pm
by Rukia
Ok... this debate has been raging long and hard and here in the bible thumping south, and has gotten no where. People (i.e Hipcritical 'Christians' who judge everyone.) Don't are just getting on a fucking soap box. They are idiots who where the word 'witch' and want to bring back the Burning Times. It's an idotic stand and if people can take into consideration that it a WORK OF FICTION they need to be shot.
Think about it... what do pirates do? Pillage and thieve. Have guests of ill respute, kill and rape....
But Mrs Jones has no problem letting lil Billy and Bobby play.
Cops and Robbers?
That being said the books aren't literary masterpieces but they are good fantasy pop-culture works.
I like them and don't care what you think.
#9
Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 2:31 am
by The Cleric
Something Awesome wrote:I would have no objections to the Harry Potter books being banned, gathered together, and burned, but that's just because I find them to be truly awful stories. Harry Potter has as much literary merit to be in schools as, say, James Frey's A Million Little Pieces, or even the Pokemon movie novelizations.
They're not "bad" in the sense of "evil," but rather "bad" as in a "disgusting waste of trees."
IIRC, the books are simply available in the library, and are not mandated readings.
#10
Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 3:38 am
by Narsil
Considering how the books have launched a whole new generation into reading, thus preserving literacy, I find that they are very bloody important. Are they groundbreaking and changed the world? Well, yes, they bloody are groundbreaking, and are saving many people from the infinite gulf that is illiteracy.
#11
Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 12:28 pm
by Rukia
Narsil wrote:Considering how the books have launched a whole new generation into reading, thus preserving literacy, I find that they are very bloody important. Are they groundbreaking and changed the world? Well, yes, they bloody are groundbreaking, and are saving many people from the infinite gulf that is illiteracy.
good point.
And to add to that I'd rather see my four year old brother learn to read and pick up a Harry Potter book than something that requires no imagination.
"That dog ran fast. Suzy chased the dog..."
Least with books like Harry Potter you get to be/go back to being a kid again.
#12
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:58 pm
by Ali Sama
I remember that asshole who said i was commiting a sin by playing chess in a club at school. God I hate religiose fundies.
#13
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 3:55 pm
by Batman
Ali Sama wrote:I remember that asshole who said i was commiting a sin by playing chess in a club at school. God I hate religiose fundies.
Ok this I gotta hear.
#14
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:52 pm
by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman
Ali Sama wrote:I remember that asshole who said i was commiting a sin by playing chess in a club at school. God I hate religiose fundies.
Wait, playing chess is sin?
#15
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:54 pm
by frigidmagi
Wait, playing chess is sin?
Not in any church I've ever heard of.
#16
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:01 am
by Ali Sama
Batman wrote:Ali Sama wrote:I remember that asshole who said i was commiting a sin by playing chess in a club at school. God I hate religiose fundies.
Ok this I gotta hear.
His reason, from what i found, was that peopel gamble on the games and it has no sport value, hence is a gamblign game. Yes. people are that stupid.
#17
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:05 am
by Faqa
His reason, from what i found, was that peopel gamble on the games and it has no sport value, hence is a gamblign game. Yes. people are that stupid.
I guess God-fearing Christians play football on Sundays or something?
Jeebus, that's fucked up.
Considering how the books have launched a whole new generation into reading, thus preserving literacy, I find that they are very bloody important. Are they groundbreaking and changed the world? Well, yes, they bloody are groundbreaking, and are saving many people from the infinite gulf that is illiteracy.
In my experience, it doesn't tend to promote reading. Just reading of the HP series. They remain essentially illiterate. They've just read HP as a stopover before continuing on that road.
Like Dan Brown's stuff, really(though HP is far superior, since it would still be famous without dumping in the lowest form of sensationalism). You can not read and still read those books.
#18
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:40 pm
by vampykat
My parents are born again pentacostal christians. I was raised this way and was made to attend church services Sunday morning, Sunday Evening, Tuesday Evening, Thursday evening and occasionaly on Saturdays.
My parents are still very umm bible thumperish, if you will, and freak out that I allow my 7 year old daughter to watch anything that has to do with witchcraft, occult, fantasy, etc etc...
If they only knew I was Wiccan, life would be hell for me and mine. LOL
I just ignore them, my daughter has already learned to just let it go in one ear and out the other when they "preach" to her about watching Harry Potter movies and such. She doesn't understand, even at her age, how grandma and grandpa cannot understand it is just a story.
The only irony I have is that they hired me to do their church website and they don't have a clue of what I believe...
*smirkles and totters out*
#19
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:44 pm
by frigidmagi
I got to note that's such a minority opinion (the chess thing) that I've never even heard of it and I was brought up in the depths of the community. Hell I know at least two fundalmentist minsters who are chess fanatics to the point of playing each other from oceans away, they fucking mailed each other their moves (this was 1980s, e-mail was pretty much unheard of, so think about it).
On the Harry Potter thing, my father is an ex-pentalcostal minster. He loves the books, not so fond of the movies, says they leave to much out.
Me? I can't get into to them to much, I keep wanting to slap Harry in the back of his thick skull.
#20
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:11 pm
by Batman
Of course there's a difference between not liking the HP books and wanting them banned because they deal with witches and stuff.
Personally I can't but suspect that at least some religious fundies refuse to accept that Harry Potter is just a story because that might open some people to the thought that maybe, so is the Bible...
#21
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:17 pm
by frigidmagi
Actually it's several factors, recall that none of these people have called for a ban on Lord of Rings or other popular books.
One, Harry waves a wand around and by the process of spouting a string of nonsense does magic, these knuckleheads think their kids will actually try it and fall into some kind of dark cult. No shit, they're not kidding, they actually believe this.
Two, Harry's not a Christian, worst he's not religious in any sense of the word, he doesn't invoke any high good or spirit. To them this means he must of course... be an athiest and they won't stand for athiest heros. Least not for their kids.
Three, disinformation, a number of less than honest groups for various reasons have falsified the contents of the series. One went so far as to claim Harry practiced animal sarifice to the Dark Lord. Since most of these people won't bother reading it for themselves... *shrug*
Why the disinformation? Same reasons politicans lie, money and power. These groups are supported by donations more often than not and it's easier to get money from scared worried people than relaxed happy people. Even then the ban Harry Potter group is a minority, if it was a majority the books wouldn't be best sellers.
#22
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:28 pm
by Batman
Remember that the HP books became immensely popular practically overnight, while LotR wormed it's way into the public conciousness over half a century or so. I can see fundies concidering HP to be a much more immediate and dire threat.
#23
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:37 pm
by frigidmagi
Well Lord of the Rings became very popular in the 60s, LotR's has a cyclical relationship with pop culture, I figure in 20 years it'll be Harry Who?
But it does help that Lord of the Rings as several Christian like themes running through it, but that only makes sense with Tolken being a conservative catholic. Written works tend to reflect their writers.
#24
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:03 pm
by Mayabird
frigidmagi wrote:Well Lord of the Rings became very popular in the 60s, LotR's has a cyclical relationship with pop culture, I figure in 20 years it'll be Harry Who?
But it does help that Lord of the Rings as several Christian like themes running through it, but that only makes sense with Tolken being a conservative catholic. Written works tend to reflect their writers.
Of course, many people take those too far and claim the LotR is a Christian allegory, which it most certainly is not. Tolkein
hated allegory, and IIRC he and C.S. Lewis had quite a falling out over the heavy-handed allegory in the Chronicles of Narnia.
While I'm here, let's not forget the people who read the Onion article about the Harry Potter/Satanism connection and actually believed it. A lot of these people aren't exactly the sharpest knives in the drawer.
#25
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:11 pm
by frigidmagi
Of course, many people take those too far and claim the LotR is a Christian allegory, which it most certainly is not. Tolkein hated allegory, and IIRC he and C.S. Lewis had quite a falling out over the heavy-handed allegory in the Chronicles of Narnia.
You should catch what he said to people who wanted to make it an allegory of WWII. His goal was to make a mythical past story, not to reflect any present day events. Present day for him I mean.